Man wins $102,000, casino cries malfunction
By Darren Murph 
posted Jan 25th 2007 5:36PM
posted Jan 25th 2007 5:36PM
We're fully aware that getting too clever while in a casino is likely to land you behind bars, but a Pennsylvania man is now crying foul after he got the short end of the stick in an unfortunate "mishap." The retired carpenter, who had visited the Philadelphia Park casino before, dropped his two quarters into a Wheel of Fortune slot machine only to win $102,000 -- or so he thought. The machine proudly conveyed his winnings right alongside his actual name, sending his emotions into a jovial whirlwind, but apparently the machine wasn't exactly supposed to, you know, let people hit the jackpot, and now he's fighting just to get his due reward. A spokesperson for the venue stated that it "was just an error in the communication system," but added the mistake seems to have originated in the in-house computing system, not within the machine itself. The man was offered "two tickets to the buffet" (saywha?) and advised to read the disclaimer on the machine, nullifying any awards if the machine malfunctions, but he still feels that this "fault" is illegitimate. So if you're the next person to strike it rich in a questionable casino, try not to get your hopes up too high, alright?[Via TechDirt]
The way I see it casinos are where you go to play games of chance.
By 'chance' there was a malfunction with the machine/system.
Like Sam 'Ace' Rothstein said "In the casino, the cardinal rule is to keep them playing and keep them coming back. The longer they play, the more they lose. In the end, we get it all"
Two tickets to the buffet? wtf? Malfunction or not, I suspect many gamblers will be boycotting the Philadelphia Park "Casino" and taking their chances elsewhere.
No, no they probably wont. I'd say the odds are pretty good that people will sill show up.
I need to start up a casino. Now, to find a way to trace my family back to the Native Americans...
Are you kidding me? This is why gambling is so heavily regulated. If a house could just claim 'equipment malfunction' whenever someone strikes it rich, the lotto and several other 'gambling' schemes would be underwater.
I hope this guy fights for what's his. Granted, the machine could've really failed- but, maybe this will show them to keep up manufacturing.
Chris
This is exactly why the rich get richer. They can create a system to "bleed a mutha&%$#@ dry" but the minute they loose just a small fraction of what they steal..uh.. earn they cry foul. Complete and utter BS! Give the man his money.
I love how you cultivate your victimhood. Because we all know there is no fucking choice; there is a gun to our heads,forcing us to gamble our paychecks at the casino. You want to have fun? Spend some disposable income at the casino. You want to be rich? Save it.
I keep hearing stories like this. I would just try and avoid any computerized gambling and stick with the tables.
Casinos are stupid.
check check, all night you check, nyet. Give that man his money.
Rounders FTW.
Even better, Indian Casinoes are on tribal land and not subject to U.S. law. They can deny a payout for any reason they want.
It's not supposed to let people hit the jackpot? How the heck is that legal?
I've worked in the casino industry for more then 13 years. Machines malfunction in casinos just like your home electronics do. Casinos pay out big jackpots all the time, and a 102k jackpot on a WOF machine really isn't that big a deal.
If he had actually won the money the casino would have paid him. The slot got a false signal from the controller and freaked out. If this had happened at an ATM, and his account balance had suddenly shown an extra 100k, his bank wouldn't let him keep the money either.
apples to oranges
ATMs are not a game of chance nor are they advertised as a game of chance.
An ATM is not supposed to give you money that you don't already have.. a slot machine is. Don't compare the two because they are not the same. The casino fucked up, they should have to pay.
In Philly, this has been huge news all over radio lately. But there are a few point Engadget missed.
1)The man didn't have a winning combination.
2) The machine was not supposed to pay-out over $5,000
And he wasn't offered just 2 buffet tickets... he was also offered $100 in credits.
I hope he gets some type of compensation. Being as the Harrahs is a new casino, I'm sure there has to still be bugs they are working out. As the DJs siad this morning, either they will settle for a decent price or another casino in Atlantic City or Las Vegas will offer him some nice perks just for some free airtime.
Thanks for the info Zach.
In that case, they should have just paid him the max payout of the machine. Because, if you play at a machine whose max jackpot is $5k, then it's not reasonable to expect to win more than $5k. If the casino did that, they would have acted in good faith and saved $97k.
By reading the article, they say they are not entitled to pay out if the -machine- malfunctions.
Then the casino rep goes on to say it wasn't a malfunction with the machine but with an internal system of the casino. By the letter, they would still have to pay.
'A spokesperson for the venue stated that it "was just an error in the communication system," but added the mistake seems to have -----> originated in the in-house computing system, --_--> not within the machine itself. The man was offered "two tickets to the buffet" (saywha?) and advised to read the disclaimer on the machine, nullifying any awards if the -----> machine malfunctions'
Looks like a weasel & smells like a weasel.
I'm never going to Philadelphia Park Casino (I live not to far away) This is just ridiculous.
Sounds like Engadget has finally found somebody more evil than Sony.
did we really need to mention sony in this thread? jeez, you sony haters know no bounds.
The part that confuses me is that it specifically says the problem is not the machine, but with their computer system. According to the above article the disclaimer covers malfunctions involving the actual machine. Not knowing the exact problem or wording of the disclaimer makes it imposable to know what is going on. I hope he at least gets something for his troubles.
Yeah, so first of all, what the hell is the point of a slot machine that's not supposed to allow you to win? Isn't that just called "panhandling"?
Second of all, how is it legal that a casino can open its doors, promote its games of chance, and then when somebody wins, say "oops, that was a mistake on our part, so we don't need to pay you."
What if the guy was playing blackjack? "Oh, sorry, we told the dealer not to let anyone win, so, you know, we're not responsible for paying out if anybody does."
wtf?
Folks, it happens. Modern slot machines are computers, and computers malfunction. They're subject to memory corruption, hack attempts, and coding glitches just like any other computer.
If he wants to file a complaint with the local regulators, he can, but he'd almost certainly lose. The casino loses more in bad publicity from stories like this than they do in paying it out, but they can't pay out every time a machine hiccups.
Massive negative publicity is what that casino needs.
I don't care if it's a malfunction. If it's their fuck up - they should deal with it.
The little disclaimer provides for a machine problem. Not an internal casino system, external to the machine...
also happens at winstar casino in oklahoma. so sad
$750 jackpot denied...
$640 jackpot denied...
http://www.wfaa.com/sharedcontent/dws/wfaa/bharris/stories/wfaa060429_mo_casino.7a56aa26.html
This casino should be closed down or something. Isn't hat illegal to do that. That man should fight for the money he deserves and should even try to get that sleazy place closed down.
Games of chance are regulated; typically, there is a state-mandated minimum payout. For example, a regulation may state that a slot machine must pay out 98 cents on the dollar. Slot machines are now computer controlled, so the algorithm that is used to determine whether you win or not is precisely calibrated to achieve a given payout.
That said, I do wonder what this guy's theory for recovery is.
Mmmmmm. Let's start with fraud, or unjust enrichment. The disclaimer, depending on wording, may or may not cover the central computer system- but I doubt if a court would stretch a disclaimer that far, particularly given the admission that the machine itself did not malfunction. Of course- I haven't practiced on the civil side for some time- but if this happened in my circuit, I would be deeply interested in just how often this happens. Might need to bring it before a grand jury.
After all- if you can claim a software glitch negates the win- then how easy is it to program or claim a glitch for every win over a certain amount?
I feel for the guy, I really do. But he's going to have a tough time getting the money. Slot machines are programmed to pay out exact odds that are set on the machine. These machines are all linked to a central system in the casino that randomizes the payout to each of its machines. If the system malfunctions and pays out more than the set odds, it is...a malfunction.
That is so wack... I would have taken a sledge hammer to every single machine in that place if they did that to me, and then told them, didn't you read my M-F-N warning label, YOU MF casino, FU ALL... and then I would pour a gallon of gas on the carpet and light it wity my dunhill lighter... HERE IS A MULFUNCTION IDIOTS!!!!
I understand that defects in the hardware or code could cause problems--but humans are fallible, too. What happens if a blackjack dealer screws up and I win? Do they get to claim "backsies" and keep my money?
Only if it is caught before the payout is actually made. Most of the time even then they will let it go. Of course if the dealer makes that kind of mistake very often, the dealer will be let go as well.
CIGR...
the ATM analogy doesnt make sense, a bank is not a casino
whats from stopping them from saying every person that wins is a malfunction. thats total BS
SO the machine "jackpotted" because of a malfunction and, as per the disclaimer. the casino is not responsible. So what happens if the coding glitch is in the casino's favor and the machine doen't pay out as a result? Are the gamblers for the oast week or 30 days refunded their money??? Of course not, the casino wins. Maybe they get a slap on the wrist and a small fine for the machine not hitting the required payout % but the gamblers get screwed. Stay clear of this casino.
Hah! This is why Indian casinos have thousands of dollars just to toss around...
I just got an order last week for a 14,400 sq. foot mosaic mural, for a new Indian Casino in Michigan, our bid was $700,000 for the job.
"I love how you cultivate your victimhood."
What are you talking about?
"Because we all know there is no fucking choice; there is a gun to our heads,forcing us to gamble our paychecks at the casino."
What does that have to do with anything?
Look, the guy wasn't cheating. The machine said he won. Don't care if it was a "malfunction", pay the guy. If you (the casino) can't afford machines that work, I guess you can't afford to do business, can you? Tough noogies.
The bank analogy doesn't work. When an ATM gives me more money than I asked for, I know something's wrong. But a gambler doesn't ask for a certain amount of money, instead he gambles that he will get a certain amount. The casino can only get out from under their part of the deal if they can prove that it was unreasonable for the gambler to assume that the stakes were this high. If the machine is programmed to pay out $100k+ once in a while, the gambler has every right to assume that he is the winner of that amount.
The ATM analogy isn't perfect, but it does demonstrate the point.
Slot can malfunction and look like a jackpot for several reasons. A winning combo can be shown on the reels, but not pay because the reels were misaligned.
A power surge can cause the machine to reset, which will cause the machine to spin back to what appears to be a winning combo, but there is no payout as the machine is just reseting to it's original position.
What apparently happened in this case, was a false jackpot message was sent to the card reader when there was no winning combo showing.
If there was not a winning combo showing on the screen then the man should have had no reasonable expectation that he had actually won.
The WOF machines routinely pay out huge jackpots and the casinos gladly pay them. In this case the man simply did not win.
I remember in school the teachers always said that if you or they found a mistake in their grade & it gave you a higher # then they gave it to you, but if it was not in your favor then you were in luck.
Sounds like this casino's got it the wrong way.
Plus- okay, so they don't give it to this guy. How do we know their machine's not making mistakes in the other direction & folks are supposed to win, but the computer doesn't say. Do you think they're calling up people that thought they'd lost to give them a check? I doubt that.
I dont think this guy will see one red cent from the casino. But I sure hope he DOES. Mistake or not, the machine said he won. Fix the mistake for the next time.
The house always wins.
Seriously though,I think the guy here really has a legitimate case. The casino here probably would need to prove that the behavior of the machine was of a "malfunction" and not an "anomaly" that someone jackpotted. Unless this thing was giving out 100k every spin, I say the guy could win.
$102,000 for bad publicity. Godd Job you idiots! Now you lose ten times more than that because people will no longer go there.
Gambling is a tax on people who don't understand probability and statistics.
SUE THEIR ASS AND GET YOUR MONEY!!!!1
Hmmm.....I wonder if there are people that lost when they really should have won. I bet the casinos would feel real bad if that happened. ;)
The subject of "bad programming" only seems to have been mentioned once so far, so I'm going to mention it again. If this was a "bad signal" being sent back to the central system, it sounds like someone created a system and didn't check for possible errors. I don't believe that the computer "malfunctioned" as much as the programmer(s) made some mistakes in error-handling. Software doesn't malfunction; software engineers malfunction. I'm sure the program did exactly what it is programmed to do, except that the engineers didn't check for that case when doing QA.
Other than the obvious *"the guy said it was the central system that screwed up, not the machine" even though the label says they won't pay if the machine malfunctions* argument, I would argue and say that "no, nothing malfunctioned, you just paid for a product that wasn't thoroughly tested for all cases."
Negative publicity?
Myspace to the rescue. I give it one and a half weeks before its on CNN.
So who's gonna do it?